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GTWA- god talks with arjuna


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Steve Hydonus
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« Reply #15 on: Apr 25, 2019 12:49 pm »

"Attunement with God as Aum lifts the consciousness to the immanent Christ Consciousness. Through Christ Consciousness the yogi ascends to Cosmic Consciousness in the highest cerebral center. 'No man cometh unto the Father(Cosmic Consciousness), but by me(through the Son, or Christ Consciousness).' These states of the 'Holy Trinity' are symbolized in Hindu scriptures as Aum, Tat, Sat- Holy Ghost vibration, Kutastha, and God."

Hello Eric what concerns me is that we as spiritual seekers are led into a materialistic interpretation of the Bible’s words by following traditional Christianity. That is to say that the attainment of God as Aum and bringing the consciousness to the level of Christ Consciousness and Cosmic Consciousness is merely a fiction propagated by delusional yogis. Furthermore no man comes to the Father but by the only path of Jesus the man. Not by some ethereal fictitious consciousness the yogis came up with. In fact that type of opinion is a conspiracy planned by the 😈 devil to lead people to all kinds of false doctrines that take Jesus the man out of the position of the only way to God.

We as yogis should recognize that this Christian materialistic interpretation of the Bible can discourage us from our own practice of the Om technique and meditation in general in favor of church doctrine. This is the same thing that happened in early Christianity and led to the crucifixtion of Jesus because of his views of for instance the temple. Because it was said in the Bible that in the day of the coming of the Lord the Jewish temple would be brought down and in three days raised again. Ofcourse the Jews took it literally and materialistically and said that Jesus could never take down the temple in three days and raise it again. But ofcourse we know that Jesus was not referring to a  temple as in a building but rather his on temple; the human body. But for this heresy and others Jesus was crucified and continues to be by Christianity that claims Jesus as the only son of God. Jesus never meant he as the body was the only way to God but rather he as the Chrst Counsciousmess was the only way to God.

Om Christ Om Christ Om Christ Om
Om Guru Om Guru Om Guru Om
« Last Edit: Apr 25, 2019 12:59 pm by Steve Hydonus » Report Spam   Logged

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« Reply #16 on: Apr 25, 2019 07:00 pm »

Hello Steve, I'm a little confused by your concern. I don't study many doctrines but when reading those of interest I look with discernment and let Spirit guide me to right understanding. I try not to worry about what others might do and I agree with you- I think it's important to realize what Christ taught has definitely been skewed through perception, fear and greed as it is recounted even by his closet disciples. I don't think it important to rely solely on someone elses accounts of his teachings but to guide one within, awaken one to his/her highest ideal, actualizing ones deepest desire and having Faith this life is guided by Love. It isn't the books, it's the experience and the belief that we are more than our bodies, that there is a fragment of the Father in all of us. That's just my take, but what you are reading in my initial post is quoting the Gita. The above quote is from Yogananda in God Talks With Arjuna describing verses 15-18. All of this to describe the epic battle between King Ego and King Soul inside the devotee who practices meditation. The troops are being rallied and here he is describing a part of the journey,

Quote
15 Hrishikesha (Krishna) blew his Panchajanya; Dhananjaya (Arjuna), his Devadatta; and Virkodara (Bhima), of terrible deeds, blew his great conch Paundra.

16 King Yudhisthira, the son of Kunti, blew his Anantavijaya; Nakula and Sahadeva blew, respectively, their Sughosha and Manipushpaka.

17 The King of Kashi, excellent archer; Sikhandi, the great warrior, Dhrishtadyummma, Virata, the invincible Satyaki,

18 Drupada, the sons of Draupadi, and the might-armed son of Subhardra, all blew their own conches, O Lord of Earth.


In these verses reference is made to the specific vibratory sounds(the conch shells of the various Pandavas) the meditating devotee hears emanating from the astral centers in the spine and medulla. Pranava, the sound of the creative Aum vibration, is the mother of all sounds. The intelligent cosmic energy of Aum that issues forth from God, and is the manifestation of God, is the creator of substance of all matter. This holy vibration is the link between matter and Spirit. Meditation on Aum is the way to realize the true Spirit-essence of all creation. By inwardly following the sound of Pranava to its source, the yogi's consciousness is carried aloft to God.

In the microcosmic universe of the body of man, the Aum vibration works through the vital activities in the astral spinal centers of life with their creative vibratory elements (tattvas) of earth, water, fire, air, and ether. Through these, man's body is created, enlivened, and sustained. These vibrations emit characteristic vibrations of Pranava as they operate.* The devotee whose consciousness becomes attuned to the inner astral sounds finds himself gradually ascending to higher states of realization.

* "I was in the Spirit (spiritual consciousness) on the Lord's day (the day of contacting the divine realms of truth), and heard behind me (in the medulla, 'behind' or in the back of the head) a great voice, as a trumpet (the great blissful sound of Aum)....And I turned to see the voice that spake with me. And being turned, I saw seven golden candlesticks(the seven astral centers); and in the midst of the seven candlesticks one (the astral body) like unto the son of man (similar in appearance to the physical body)...and his voice as the sound of many waters (the sound of the elements, tattvas, emanating from the astral centers)" (Revelation 1:10, 12, 13, 15).
Page 116

In this section he writes in detail the differing states of samadhi as defined by Patanjali.
Samprajnata - Savikalpa Samadhi (with difference) "...divine union in which there remains some distinction between the knower and the known"
and
Asamprajnata - Nirvikalpa Samadhi (without difference) "...the highest yoga or union manifested by fully liberated masters or those on the threshold of soul freedom."

Before attaining Nivrikalpa Samadhi there are four stages one goes through in Samprajnata...
Simply,
1) Savitarka (with doubt or conjecture)
2) Savichara (with reasoning or pondering)
3) Sananda (with joy)
4) Sasmita (with 'I-ness' or individuality)
"These four states which come after interiorization (pratyahara), are the result of deep concentration (dharana), or superconscious perception as limited to the body."

He thus details these experiences a devotee might have working his/her way through the spinal chakras and how Aum might sound through each.

1) Sahadeva with the conch Manipushpaka "(that which becomes manifest by sounds), represents the earth element in the coccygeal center (muladhara chakra) in the spine." Savitarka.
2) Nakula with his conch Sughosha "(that which sounds clearly and sweetly), represents the water element manifested in the sacral center (svadhishthana chakra)." Savichara.
3) Arjuna aka Dhananjaya with his conch named Devadatta "(that which gives joy), represents the fire element in the lumbar center (manipura chakra). Sananda samprajnata samadhi.
4) Bhima with Paundra "(that which disintegrates the lower states), represents the air or life force (prana) element in the dorsal center (anahata chakra). Sasmmita.

Above are the four stages of savikalpa samadhi which lead to nirvikalpa

Yudhisthira with the conch Anantavijaya "(that which conquers infinity), represents the ether elment in the cervical center of the spine (vishuddha chakra). In this state the four preceding phases of interiorization- mental (manas), intellectual (buddhi), perceptive (chitta), and egoistic (asmita)-have been dissolved, giving rise to a deeper state of pure intuitive perception of limitless bliss, the state called asamprajnata samadhi."

I am sharing this to give context to the above quote and for those who might not have the book. It's a lot but definitely interesting, if you have questions or would like me to quote even more, like what Aum might sound like in each chakra I am happy to post.

Sri Krishna aka Hrishikesha (Lord of the senses) then blows his conch Panchajanya "(that which generates the five tattvas or elements). This 'symphony' of the five sounds of Pranava is heard in the united medullary and Christ-consciousness center (ajna chakra). Here the devotee enjoys a greater savikalpa samadhi. He attains full realization of God in His creative aspect, manifested as the Aum vibration."

Steve, here is further elaboration by Yogananda from my earlier post.

Quote
When the yogi's union with God is experienced in these elevated states wherein the consciousness has been lifted to the centers in the medulla (pure superconsciousness of the soul), the point between the eyebrows (Kutastha or Christ consciousness), and the cerebrum (cosmic consciousness), he realizes the higher significance of samprajnata and asamprajnata as, respectively, savikalpa samadhi and nirvikalpa samadhi.

Now in Gita verses 17 and 18, are mentioned the other key Pandava warriors whose significance has been elaborated on in the interpretation of earlier verses. These divine Pandavas, following the lead of Krishna and the five Pandus, sound their respective conches. These are the supportive nadis, or astral nerve currents, conductors of life energy, whose vibratory activities also produce characteristic sounds. All these vibrations during meditation are turned Godward to spiritualize the whole body and mind and draw the consciousness inward towards Self-realization.

To a materalist, the whole world-its complications of solids, liquids, fire, gases and so forth-seems to be composed of real material substances. 'This is the way I perceive it; therefore, it must be fact.' But the advanced yogi, whose Self-realization has penetrated to the inner source of external matter, is able to say: 'This world, this cosmos, are only shadows of life thrown on the screen of space, and reflected in our conscious and subconscious mental chambers.'

The yogi, peering with closed eyes into the dark invisibility within, finally finds there six subtle astral booths-the coccygeal, sacral, lumbar, dorsal, cervical, and the combined medullary and Christ centers, situated in the spinal column, and at the base of the brain and the point between the eyebrows. He sees that true-to-life picture of his body is produced by an earth current in the coccyx, a water vibration in the sacral, a fire vibration in the lumbar, an air vibration in the dorsal, an ether vibration in the cervical, and a consciousness-and-life force vibration in the medulla and Christ centers.

To summarize the important significance of the sounding conch shells by the Pandavas in these Gita verses:
The worldly man whose attention is matter-bound hears only the noises of the external world. But in the psychological and metaphysical battle between the sense mind and the soul-bound discrimination, both the warring senses and the soul forces give rise to the various vibrations in an effort to win the consciousness of the meditating devotee. During meditation, the devotee's attention first leaves the realm of physical sounds in the material world. Then the attention is caught by the various sounds resulting from inner activities of the physical body... By deeper meditation, the devotee goes beyond the inner physical sounds; and when he passes through the astral kingdom, he begins to hear the various vibratory sounds of the astral vital forces... Locating the centers, he in time actually sees them. This achievement ordinarily requires years of meditation under the guidance and blessing of an advanced guru. Finally, viewing the centers, and ascending his consciousness through them in the various stages of samadhi, the yogi has solved the mystery of the body; he knows it as a manipulatable form of light vibrations.
« Last Edit: Apr 25, 2019 07:12 pm by tides2dust » Report Spam   Logged

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« Reply #17 on: Jun 23, 2019 12:27 am »

from Verse 27 Page 141,
"The reason few people seek God in earnest as do the saints is that millions believe they cannot do without evil, misery-producing pleasures. They are addicted, as is the alcoholic toward health-killing drink. But these very persons, if they were to form good habits, would say: 'We cannot do without the pleasure and peace of meditation. We become miserable now if we have to mingle in our old environments.'
  Those who cling to their materialistic nature fail to understand why the pleasure-producing senses are inimical to the joy of the Spirit.
'Why,' they ask, 'were the senses given to man if he is not to enjoy them?' (This query is supposed to completely 'floor' the ascetic!)
  The metaphysical reason for self-control is nothing but a spiritual business proposition calculated to bring the greatest happiness to man. Just as one must invest a certain sum of money in order to reap a greater gain, so the devotee forgoes indulgence in materialistic pleasures for the sake of gaining the pure joy of Spirit found in meditation."

Page 142,
"Man is the image of God; within himself, as the tree is hidden in the seed, is the latent unmanifested bliss of the Spirit."
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« Reply #18 on: Jun 23, 2019 04:26 pm »

Interesting notes,
Krishna is referred to as ones inner-guide.

I find this battle takes place outside meditation as well.

Many times it seems more appropriate to me to let the sense desires come out rather than constantly suppressing them and letting them surface in awkward and socially unacceptable ways. Not sure how the Master would respond to this; perhaps it’s best to pray and seek guidance. Because we seldom know what’s best for us. In the meantime back to the kriya’s practicing the presence and cultivating a spiritual climate around us. God has a way of sheltering his devotees who are committed to enlightenment and sincere in their efforts despite their desires that work against their spiritual resolutions.
Hi Steve,
In the above post, the argument is that the senses are meant to be enjoyed. I consider myself a novice yogi and have heard Yogananda and Inayat Khan say something similar with what I am about to share. When it comes to renunciation, we are at different levels of understanding in our lives, all good. One should not force themselves into renunciation. The object then is to be in the World without being consumed by the world. Quoting Yogananda, "Anyone will find solitude tormenting if his mind dwells on what he has renounced and not on the all-absorbing Divine presence."
So back to the argument, the senses are meant to be enjoyed. I would say this is true and it is true that they offer us much much more. We are here, in these bodies, to learn as is being continually taught by Nature by means of dual expression. While it is true we can enjoy our senses, inside of us is the potential for so much more. We are more than a vegetable or the animal that barks at its own reflection. I think it's important to realize that we are here to Learn and Progress towards the ideal, which is the life purpose of every soul.
From one who often indulges the senses and desires in excess, eventually we recognize lasting happiness is not found by external means. Indulge if you will but strive to be ever mindful and centered on Love. The offering from the Gita is here to teach us how to invest and enable the rule of King Soul acknowledging the battle between Soul and Ego as it is taught by and unfolds through Nature.
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