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Steve Hydonus
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« Reply #15 on: Nov 29, 2015 10:33 pm »

I will say this for you Jeff because u r having difficulties with your mother over reincarnation. This is not something you prove to any one. This is something you find out and experience yourself. This is the big mistake of truth seekers. The proof comes from inner realization not outer confirmation.

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Well I'm not having difficulties, I'm actually trying to see it from her view for once. Trying to get along. I haven't changed my views, rather I would like to evolve and understand others' opinions, and maybe further evolve just as PY brought Jesus into this. BTW, your proof did come from outer sources initially, then comes to the inner. I don't think we could have imagined all the details of reincarnation on our own.

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Seeing it from her view is seeing it from a cultural stand point. Her view is the result of social conditioning. Social conditioning is so strong that most people will follow blindly the conditioning of the country and culture they come from. That is the problem in the mideast today and that is the problem here in cloneland as well.

The second part of your quote. i had an experience with reincarnation before knowing anything about reincarnation. The 'proof' as you have put it came from outer sources later. So you see it is the opposite of what you have described. i had some of these experiences with reincarnation before knowing what the term meant. Later i understood what i had experienced through other people and cultures.

We come into this life with varying degrees of spiritual experience and understanding and in different areas. Some people can remember past lives at a very young age. i did a study of this in my Masters' Thesis. It turns out that many children remember their 'real' parents from another incarnation. Some of them have even told their names and it has been discovered that these people actually lived in a previous century and had kids.

There is so many cases of past life memories that have been  corroborated through investigation that denying such evidence is foolish. What we may have differing views on is what these people, including myself, have tapped into.

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« Reply #16 on: Nov 30, 2015 10:36 am »

i did a study of this in my Masters' Thesis. It turns out that many children remember their 'real' parents from another incarnation. Some of them have even told their names and it has been discovered that these people actually lived in a previous century and had kids.
There is so many cases of past life memories that have been  corroborated through investigation that denying such evidence is foolish. What we may have differing views on is what these people, including myself, have tapped into.
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Very interesting subject for a thesis. Unfortunately, official science does not seem to give much importance to such investigations. Not that I mind much of what 'official', or academic scinece says, but a lesser degree of ungranted skepticism would give a different outlook on life to those people who cannot escape from a purely materialistic view.
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« Reply #17 on: Nov 30, 2015 07:54 pm »


Seeing it from her view is seeing it from a cultural stand point. Her view is the result of social conditioning. Social conditioning is so strong that most people will follow blindly the conditioning of the country and culture they come from. That is the problem in the mideast today and that is the problem here in cloneland as well.

To her this view may well be the correct spiritual answer, *for her*. This may be the way she needs to perceive in order to advance. Who can say? We don't know for her if it is all the result of social conditioning, it might all or part be from true spiritual knowledge.

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The second part of your quote. i had an experience with reincarnation before knowing anything about reincarnation. The 'proof' as you have put it came from outer sources later. So you see it is the opposite of what you have described. i had some of these experiences with reincarnation before knowing what the term meant. Later i understood what i had experienced through other people and cultures.

Again, and I'm not trying to be argumentative, it's just that this is your experience and your understanding of truth. #9 in the long post I made could also explain it, as could other explanations. I'm not saying I believe that either. OK? Just as we discussed in another thread about relying on modern interpretations of ancient scripts, my own interpretations could also be hybrid (I'm not saying they are), and could be something like, reincarnation does happen but not quite as others may think. (for example)


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We come into this life with varying degrees of spiritual experience and understanding and in different areas. Some people can remember past lives at a very young age. i did a study of this in my Masters' Thesis. It turns out that many children remember their 'real' parents from another incarnation. Some of them have even told their names and it has been discovered that these people actually lived in a previous century and had kids.

There is so many cases of past life memories that have been  corroborated through investigation that denying such evidence is foolish. What we may have differing views on is what these people, including myself, have tapped into.

And I would very respectfully say, that saying that denying your statement is foolish, is not helpful. If I said that there are many people who have experienced something very different and it was not the same kind of reincarnation, and then I said that anyone else who thinks different is foolish, wouldn't they take exception?

We all have had our own experiences. But the mechanisms that surround those can be different, and I don't think it's fair to say to anyone that the way they're perceiving is wrong. Sure I don't agree with some Jehovah Witness rules, but who am I to say it is wrong for that person?


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« Reply #18 on: Dec 08, 2015 05:38 am »


Seeing it from her view is seeing it from a cultural stand point. Her view is the result of social conditioning. Social conditioning is so strong that most people will follow blindly the conditioning of the country and culture they come from. That is the problem in the mideast today and that is the problem here in cloneland as well.

To her this view may well be the correct spiritual answer, *for her*. This may be the way she needs to perceive in order to advance. Who can say? We don't know for her if it is all the result of social conditioning, it might all or part be from true spiritual knowledge.

Quote
The second part of your quote. i had an experience with reincarnation before knowing anything about reincarnation. The 'proof' as you have put it came from outer sources later. So you see it is the opposite of what you have described. i had some of these experiences with reincarnation before knowing what the term meant. Later i understood what i had experienced through other people and cultures.

Again, and I'm not trying to be argumentative, it's just that this is your experience and your understanding of truth. #9 in the long post I made could also explain it, as could other explanations. I'm not saying I believe that either. OK? Just as we discussed in another thread about relying on modern interpretations of ancient scripts, my own interpretations could also be hybrid (I'm not saying they are), and could be something like, reincarnation does happen but not quite as others may think. (for example)


Quote
We come into this life with varying degrees of spiritual experience and understanding and in different areas. Some people can remember past lives at a very young age. i did a study of this in my Masters' Thesis. It turns out that many children remember their 'real' parents from another incarnation. Some of them have even told their names and it has been discovered that these people actually lived in a previous century and had kids.

There is so many cases of past life memories that have been  corroborated through investigation that denying such evidence is foolish. What we may have differing views on is what these people, including myself, have tapped into.

And I would very respectfully say, that saying that denying your statement is foolish, is not helpful. If I said that there are many people who have experienced something very different and it was not the same kind of reincarnation, and then I said that anyone else who thinks different is foolish, wouldn't they take exception?

We all have had our own experiences. But the mechanisms that surround those can be different, and I don't think it's fair to say to anyone that the way they're perceiving is wrong. Sure I don't agree with some Jehovah Witness rules, but who am I to say it is wrong for that person?

i believe the use of logic in defending such views or debating them is rather useless. I was willing to explore something others were not interested in. They r satisfied with beliefs which they have been indoctrinated in. I'd rather find out for myself. I do not have to prove my experiences to anyone. People can believe what they like. It just depends on what level u want to take spirituality. Spirituality is much different then religion which is based principly on belief.

We come to realize as u yourself have observed Jeff... maybe she needs to be where she is at. I am not saying that having different views is foolish. I am saying that denying the evidence is. It is a constant battle with these people as Jesus himself experienced. I have better things to do.... to find more of my own lite. Christians are notorious for trying to convert you to their ideologies. The darkness of others can hold us back. Galalio  was tried for heresy, put under house arrest and forced to recant his views. We have seen the misery church people have forced on others. Today we know the heliocentric  view is true. God is not dead. Religion has made him so.
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« Reply #19 on: Dec 08, 2015 10:52 pm »

Jeff most of us have only taken one step in the ocean.
We only have seen the views from above. There is so much to discover underneath as well.
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« Reply #20 on: Jan 04, 2016 01:48 am »

Jeff most of us have only taken one step in the ocean.
We only have seen the views from above. There is so much to discover underneath as well.

There's really so many ways to slice it, no? She had a visit from Jehovah Witness the other day, since they live nearby, and while she is adamant about her beliefs, (as many people seem to be), she treated them with respect and offered them more than I would've. You don't see compassion and tolerance of others like that very often.
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« Reply #21 on: Jan 11, 2016 09:51 pm »

I can't remember or recall anything from the past. I have a pretty good memory too.

Ever feel like the world was a tuxedo and you are a pair of brown shoes? --George Gobel

https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=pbpc-NJHcZ8#t=502



The fact that we may not remember our former lives does not mean that we did not exist before. We do not remember the nine months of are embryonic existence in this life nor do we remember when we were 6 months old. It is all the less likely therefore that we would remember when we had lived in a different body with a different brain and nervous system and of different appearance.

It is well that we do not remember our hard experiences in the school of past lives,  we might be discouraged at the prospect of having to struggle with them again we might even feel disinclined to be good again, imagining good deeds to be of no value or we might be bored by repetition. Who would care to live over again all the prankster childhood the comedies of youth the tragedies of old age or even if even one lifetime. Think what a blessing reincarnation is. It demolishes our rickety old body car and gives us a brand new model in which to try again to win the race of life.

It requires years of concentrated mental investigation to know one's former incarnations. You can know about reincarnation not by reading books or hearing lectures but through scientific metaphysical research. Reincarnation is the only logical solution to the mystery of the purpose of our lives. We are immortal souls destined to return one day to our home in God. If we die in the consciousness of mortal imperfection we cannot immediately go back to God. We must eradicate our acquired egotistic imperfections by right living. To re-establish  our sole perfection may require many lives~Paramahansa  Yogananda 
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« Reply #22 on: Jan 12, 2016 12:41 am »

Another issue, not much commented,  is that we 'reincarnate' a few times even in our own lifetime.

For example, my mental setup definitely changed from childhood to boyhood to later stages of life. Even bodily appearance changed. I can show you that with pictures that are completely different.

So, even if I look back at myself 30 years ago, it feels like a previous life.

Should I remember my previous lives in other bodies, I'd feel like remembering the memories of other persons. So, would that help me? I Don't know
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« Reply #23 on: Jan 13, 2016 02:38 am »

The fact that we may not remember our former lives does not mean that we did not exist before.

Or maybe what was before is not the same as it is now.

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Reincarnation is the only logical solution to the mystery of the purpose of our lives.

Only God knows that. We cannot assume we know "why". That is illogical.

I think mccoy is on track, we change all the time even in our own lifetime. We don't really know what kind of state we were in before. It may be something completely different than Earth. If we think we were here before, or if some vision has shown you past history, no one knows if those are there to divert you or not. If you're susceptible to such things, that would be an ideal doorway for diversion.

I think we always existed and always will. Trying to put that into some sort of physical theory is plausible, but not the be all.



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« Reply #24 on: Feb 29, 2016 04:17 pm »

Dr. Tucker brings cases of children remembering past lives in his book 'Return to Life: Extraordinary Cases of Children Who Remember Their Past Lives."

Close to three quarters of the cases investigated by the team are "solved" meaning that a person from the past matching the child's memories is identified.

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« Reply #25 on: Mar 01, 2016 04:35 pm »

There is a fascinating series of books on this topic by Michael Newton Phd.  Dr. Newton used hypnotherapy to regress thousands of people through their current lives to assist in finding the possible sources of psychological problems, in an effort to help rid them of them.  In doing this, he began to see a pattern in that frequently memories began resurfacing from lives prior to the patient's current life.  Sometimes the lives were on different planets or other dimensions.  After some time, he opted to make researching this phenomenon his life's work.  My favorite is called Destiny of Souls New Case Studies of Life Between Lives - is all about where we reside in the spirit realm in between incarnations. Fascinating, detailed, mind blowing stuff!  One must take it with a grain of salt, of course, but I recommend these books for anyone interested in the topic.

Despite our various paths and beliefs, I feel there must be an ultimate truth - meaning, things are as they are - there is a design to things.  We in human form are sort of like the blind men feeling an elephant in a room.  One touches the trunk, another feels only a foot - we all percieve a different aspect and come to vastly different conclusions, but the elephant is still a whole elephant.  We just cannot see it because we are blind.  Lol.
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« Reply #26 on: Mar 02, 2016 03:43 am »

Dr. Tucker brings cases of children remembering past lives in his book 'Return to Life: Extraordinary Cases of Children Who Remember Their Past Lives."

Close to three quarters of the cases investigated by the team are "solved" meaning that a person from the past matching the child's memories is identified.

I'm sure that it happens, but it doesn't appear to happen to all of us. They may have had some kind of desire from before, or it might be some tramp soul causing mischief.

It's possible if you dwell on it long enough it might be harder to not come back here too.
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« Reply #27 on: Mar 02, 2016 05:07 pm »

There is a fascinating series of books on this topic by Michael Newton Phd.  Dr. Newton used hypnotherapy to regress thousands of people through their current lives to assist in finding the possible sources of psychological problems, in an effort to help rid them of them.  In doing this, he began to see a pattern in that frequently memories began resurfacing from lives prior to the patient's current life.  Sometimes the lives were on different planets or other dimensions.  After some time, he opted to make researching this phenomenon his life's work.  My favorite is called Destiny of Souls New Case Studies of Life Between Lives - is all about where we reside in the spirit realm in between incarnations. Fascinating, detailed, mind blowing stuff!  One must take it with a grain of salt, of course, but I recommend these books for anyone interested in the topic.

Despite our various paths and beliefs, I feel there must be an ultimate truth - meaning, things are as they are - there is a design to things.  We in human form are sort of like the blind men feeling an elephant in a room.  One touches the trunk, another feels only a foot - we all percieve a different aspect and come to vastly different conclusions, but the elephant is still a whole elephant.  We just cannot see it because we are blind.  Lol.

Hello friend

i spent sometime this morning going over some of Dr. Newton's material. It was nice of you to share it with us. If those books were around me i am sure i would pick them up and read thru them. You are quite a reader. i rarely go out and buy a book anymore but if there is one around i will look at it. Especially if it is from a friends 'library'. When i was younger; i spent quite a lot of time reading material by such people as Robert Monroe, Elizabeth Haich and Helen Grieves that covered a lot of the material you are exposing to us here. Although they were sharing much of their personal experiences.

Since then there have been quite a few personal experiences i  have had and with other people that have led me into the vault of between lives and past life encounters. So today i rely more on meditation and the magnetism that it provides to lead me to such discoveries if they are to be part of my spiritual unfoldment. Thank You so much for sharing some of your interests with us Shannon and the spiritual excitement and inspiration they generate.

At the risk of getting too personal - i have encountered some past life and between life phenomena with people here and at yoganandaji.org. It appears to me that sometimes we are not meant to tap too deeply into past life encounters with some of the people we meet and are close to because those memories may influence current outlook on the people and relationships we are now working on and with. Although i do believe it is helpful to have some past life and in between life memories and revelations to explain behavior patterns and just what we are working on again with the people and situations involved. So like most experiences there can be two ways of looking at it. If i can find few or no clues of what type of relationships i have had with others between lives or in past lives it leads me to believe that there is a lot of free choices involved. Freewill may predominate in those encounters which will 'determine' future scenarios in future episodes of reincarnation and soul travel. Generally though the desire to understand the nature of circumstances and people in our lives also leads to 'revealing' answers in one way or another.

i looked in the present and saw your post after mine. It makes me happy that you may come back to this post later on. One thing that is interesting about the internet is that to some degree we often can 'change' the past. 'b' eluded to this when he removed some of his posts. i seldom make this a practice. That is because i feel we can learn from our past and some of the mistakes we may have made. If other people can not recognize that we are no longer our past and we are moving forward then they are stuck themselves. Let us forgive and forget some things!

However as a teenager i used to write long letters to friends. Many of those letters were rewritten and some wadded up and never mailed. Others took sometime to write and later i added to them. In some ways i see writing posts in a similar manner. i remember somebody saying on line once at yoganandaji.org that i put things in later as though it may be a bad quality. i just don't see it that way. i am just putting down my ideas and later i may find a better way of expressing them. Especially if i can b kinder in some ways. It is a learning experience just watching all these things we have done in the recent (this life) and distant past (reincarnation and between lives) and trying to make adjustments to them and allowing others to do the same.

This leads to my last point. In the post below u ask if it is possible to get too attached to a spiritual family. Yes i believe it is possible to get too attached to certain spiritual groups, and certain people that you have shared many spiritual encounters with. i have found that it is often difficult to explain this to others. Because they may think u are disloyal, jealous egotistical .....any number of things. They can and have acted very angrily and vindictive. Which leads one to wonder about spiritual development of those involved and how to communicate kindly with respect for the views of others.

It also can b difficult distancing oneself from what may b outgrown relationships we have held with others that do have a certain spiritual quality. It is an interesting point that you may have encountered yourself and perhaps are sensitive to its occurrence with me and others close to me as well. Although i have also experienced that these relationships can just as easily have a friendly tone and an understanding because of qualities developed in spiritual growth. The closest example i can give is how monastics intentionally separate females and males because of this tremendous attraction and attachment that often results.
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« Reply #28 on: Mar 02, 2016 05:27 pm »

My pleasure Steve.  It's true, I have always been a book worm.  My happiest memories of childhood are curled up in hidden places with something to read.  I think it is my personality, but also because my environnment was lacking.  It's sort of like what you wrote elsewhere here - if not for technology, how would you have met all the interesting people online?  Same for me with books.  Books are magical little time capsules - you get to 'meet' people you never would have otherwise, even if they are far away or dead already.  Smiley But books alone are not enough.  Meditation is very important, more important, really.  I also have a 'little finger' that talks a lot.  My daughter and I laugh about my little finger - she always asks my little finger where she lost this or that, or what's going to happen here or there. Ha ha. 

While meditating a few days ago a thought came to mind afterwards - about soul friends, soul groups - life between lives, etc.  Maybe this post on reincarnation triggered it - or maybe events going on in my personal life  -  I am not sure.  The thought was this: is it possible that 'old souls' - those who have incarnated many, many times - who have a 'spiritual family' with whom they've played out many roles with again and again - might become attached, even addicted, to that spiritual family - and be held back because of it?  Imagine there are even higher dimensions beyond this 3d realm and even the immediate astral realm just beyond it.  Maybe some of us enjoy the play just a little too much!  Ha ha.  We take turns incarnating, or playing spirit guide for our friends from beyond, seeking each other out - playing out the lessons but not quite advancing, getting.... stuck.  I wonder.  What do you think?

P.S. I see you've added to your post above at the same time I was replying - didn't read it all thoroughly yet,  but will try to come back later tonight and do so!
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« Reply #29 on: Mar 03, 2016 02:20 am »

Hello Steve, it rings true that we are not meant to tap too deeply into past life encounters with others, for after all, God allows us a clean slate - so that we can begin again, fresh.  When I encounter someone I believe I knew before, I definitely notice it.  If they are close to me in this life, I wonder if there is unfinished business - and I often feel extremely close to them - but in general, if it is a passing aquaintance, there is merely a general familial nod, and life goes on.  I do not feel at all compelled to seek such people out.  Do you?  I figure if they are meant to play a role, they will.  Sometimes it is useful for people to experience memories of past lives, but one can rarely be sure if these 'memories' are actually our own, or merely memories from the cosmic consciousness that we happen to identify with.  Either way, if it brings growth - it is good.  If it brings stagnation, it is not so good.  I trust God to make the distinctions.  Smiley
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