Spirits.... I've been noticin'

[Jitendra Hy-do-u-no-us?]

Some people seem to be connected to dark realms of spirits and mean outlooks towards others. It is almost like this necromancy has attached to them abit. Is it a form of possession? I am making an effort to articulate in light of life experiences.

They  can be very kind at times and at other times...not so! The more I lift myself out of my own negativity-the less they affect my consciousness. Otherwise they can play on our  weaknesses and use a slow process of attrition to break down strengths of others and feed off some kind of ego hunger they crave or to fill emotional insecurities they harbor.

It is much easier to see it in others but not so easy to recognize how we have created our own types of hell or heaven (...and all the possible transitional stages in between.) by our thoughts and actions. We also punish ourselves or reward ourselves by the circumstances in which we find ourselves.

[Jitendra Hy-do-u-no-us?]

Recently I talked with a friend who admitted to having demons. His girlfriend has experienced them. When we are taken over by forces that make us act in ways that are not us we can be possessed by demons.

Have you ever had the feeling of not being able to move when in bed and struggling to awaken yourselves and gain back your volition? Perhaps at these times we are under the power of forces we do not want to have over us.

[guest88]

hi Steve, fishing for a response ? =P it's ok i like these sort of discussions ! even if we've discussed it here before
what you're describing is called sleep paralysis.

"Sleep paralysis is a phenomenon in which a person, either falling asleep or awakening, temporarily experiences an inability to move, speak or react. It is a transitional state between wakefulness and sleep characterized by complete muscle atonia (muscle weakness). It is often accompanied by terrifying hallucinations (such as an intruder in the room) to which one is unable to react due to paralysis, and physical experiences (such as strong current running through the upper body). One hypothesis is that it results from disrupted REM sleep, which normally induces complete muscle atonia to prevent the sleeper from acting out his or her dreams. Sleep paralysis has been linked to disorders such as narcolepsy, migraines, anxiety disorders, and obstructive sleep apnea; however, it can also occur in isolation."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sleep_paralysis

i've been in this state and it can be very scary. we are mostly fearful of that which we don't understand or know. when in this state, it's easy to let your fears create an unpleasant experience.
i was able to experience both sides of this(calm and fearful) and later was able to use my sleep paralysis as a gateway to having out of body experiences.

if your friend is experiencing this and doesn't want to, ask him/her to research sleep paralysis. tell her that the next time sleep paralysis occurs, to breath calmly and and focus her awareness to a single point on her body. like wiggling her big toe. she will have to mentally declare, i am going to move my big toe now. with a little bit of effort, she can break free.


 

[Jitendra Hy-do-u-no-us?]

Eric i have heard of such explanations. Scientific explanations can describe physiological phenomena. But not necessarily the spiritual world from which all physical phenomena arises. I have a friend who once told me she had a vision when she was very young. Later in life her vision actually appeared. You see scientists often believe they have an explanation for everything. To me this is egoitis.

At any rate when i was in college I spoke to people who considered themselves scientists and explained everything in scientific terms. So sure enough when i asked a behavioral scientist for an explanation there was an immediate response.... "Oh she was experiencing superstitious behavoir". Now you speak of using these experiences to have o.b.e. So i am the first to admit that I may not understand this phenomena. Yet would you completely discount my friends explanation as having a spirit controlling the body? I also have a friend that felt the presence of spirit clinging to his chest while under this bodily inmobility. He was told by a minister to chant mantras with holy names to rid himself of the spirit and it finally did work.

Perhaps we are speaking of various experiences here and it is difficult to neatly put them into categories that do not in some ways overlap.

[guest88]

Hi Steve,
i'm not discounting any one persons experience. just sharing my thoughts.
your friends experiencing a demon in the room, is as real and powerful as they make it.
i've experienced almost identical during one of my episodes.

understanding the physical aspect of sleep paralysis helped me move past the fear and to something, funner.

now i welcome my sleep paralysis for a chance to experience something unique -=)

the wiggling of the toe is also a technique that helped me learn i can break free from the feeling of being paralyzed.
perhaps by chanting mantras your friend was able to calm his mind and wake himself up... moving past his fear by shifting his focus

[Jitendra Hy-do-u-no-us?]

It is interesting to me that I experience a type of paralysis of the body in meditation at times. But i in no way feel that a tramp spirit has taken control of my body. On the contrary i feel as though I am free from the body because I am dead to it. The next step is being alive to spirit which is the purpose of dying to the body.

As you say... maybe if someone is not familiar with various spiritual states they very well could interpret them in a negative way until they recognize the significance of such occurrences.

[guest88]

i think you experience it because you are physically slowing your body down... your brain waves are moving into a more creative state... when you meditate, you carry an intention with you... whereas those who experience sleep paralysis, don't always ask to have that experience... it can create a lot of fear- especially in a dark room alone at night. it makes sense your experience would be more on the positive side.

[mccoy]

Now, sleep paralysys, that's a thing I know very well, having experienced it for 40 years and maybe having a little release in the last couple of years. We've been talking at a certain lenght about it in the Yoganandaji.org forum.
The physical, medical explanation: the body has a safety mechanism which prevents us to act out what we dream. When we wake up yet that block has not been removed yet, we experience a dreadful sense of immobilization and helplessness.
The popular explanation which, pls mark me, is common to many different cultures across the world: spirits jumping on your chest and immobilizing you. They have various names, the effect is the same, a sense of suffocation. This was also part of the farmers' common knowledge in my area, a black demon jumping on you by night, with its own name.
Metaphysical explanation, at least what I could come up with putting together my own experiences, medical explanations, Worldwide lore.
Of course the physical block exists. But in those times there is a real feeling of fear, of evil presences. Very often I mentally chanted AUM or concentrated hard on Yogananda to come out of that state. Sometimes I felt myself falling down and then trapped in that state. Very often the agonizing efforts to come out sound like screams outside. A comical aspect is that when I coummuted 2 hours by bus, I was often a prey of those  states and people would tell me I was screaming. Once I screamed so loud the driver stopped. I asked people to shake me to wake me up, it worked if they shaked strong enough. It may be scaring to other people if you don't warn.
Back to teh explanation: evil spirits may be attracted by those episodes of sleep paralysis maybe because they feel like a convenient passage to possession. They mistake it for a fallen barrier. So maybe the spirits are the consequence and not the cause for that. Other times the spirits may be the cause if they are trying to get advantage of sleep to posses you. Yogananda tells about such an episode in the black cat story, also recounted in the other forum. In his words, Satan tried to possess him in the semblance of a black cat. Pls note that these spirits in popular lore are often black-

[Jitendra Hy-do-u-no-us?]

There appears to b 1 main difference between the experiences of mccoy and Eric. Mccoy is speaking about an experience during sleep whereas Eric seems to be in the process of awakening or to have already awakened. Most people have more of a problem exercising volition when asleep since we are not usually conscious but rather in a subconscious state.

[mccoy]

There appears to b 1 main difference between the experiences of mccoy and Eric. Mccoy is speaking about an experience during sleep whereas Eric seems to be in the process of awakening or to have already awakened. Most people have more of a problem exercising volition when asleep since we are not usually conscious but rather in a subconscious state.

Steve, actually, that state is just on the border between sleep and wakefulness. I believe I and Eric are talking the same. I can usually remember what happened during sleep before my mind awakes in that state of paralysis of muscles and senses., like being in a coma and wanting to get out of it. The volition triggers when you get out of the dream and feel trapped in the fleshly jail. 

[Jitendra Hy-do-u-no-us?]

There appears to b 1 main difference between the experiences of mccoy and Eric. Mccoy is speaking about an experience during sleep whereas Eric seems to be in the process of awakening or to have already awakened. Most people have more of a problem exercising volition when asleep since we are not usually conscious but rather in a subconscious state.

Steve, actually, that state is just on the border between sleep and wakefulness. I believe I and Eric are talking the same. I can usually remember what happened during sleep before my mind awakes in that state of paralysis of muscles and senses., like being in a coma and wanting to get out of it. The volition triggers when you get out of the dream and feel trapped in the fleshly jail. 

The question which logically follows is what are we trying to get out of and consequently into? Sometimes sense deprivation leads to some interesting experiences. I have often layed on a bed or the ground after meditaing, practicing hatha yoga or sleeping and felt an interesting sense of freedom in such states. I do believe Eric had a point when he was speaking of experimenting with such events.

[mccoy]

...I do believe Eric had a point when he was speaking of experimenting with such events.

Well, it depends. If you guys experienced what I experience in that state, experimenting would not be encouraged at all. It's an excruciating sense of imprisonment in a malevolent limbo. You guys want to experiment, you are welcome to that, sorry I cannot take your invitation, lol.

That state happened often when I would nap in the afternoon and especially so under a hot sun. Also, it happened when I used to commute on buses, taking a pillow and earcuffs to sleep. In a few words, when sleep was not too comfy the likelyhood of occurance was higher. Although it happened when sleeping in the familiar home bed as well. Lately, it happens more rarely, I do not commute any longer, I sleep less, I'm getting old, any of these reasons...