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Steve Hydonus
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« on: Nov 18, 2016 03:33 am »

Fake News from Infra Wars

steve, taken from our discussions on climate change i was going to respond here,
These people have no plan for climate change. I see no plan at all. Yet they make their career ridiculing people who do. Of course we want to limit nuclear power plants as well. Wasn't it I who had all the info on Fukushima? The question is where do we start? These people on infowars do not want to start anywhere. Therefore they are proponents of cooking our planet. They are one step worst; they ridicule all the attempts made by environmentalists to do anything. They are like Nero playing his fiddle while Rome burned. They entertain themselves with satire while they watch the earth being destroyed and people are dumb enough to pay the linings of their pockets by listening. These are the dregs of our civilization who will take it to devastating climate conditions because of their own greed and need to satisfy short term comforts. They are the dregs of civilization. They will leave their problems to the generation now demonstrating on campuses who would like to have a future for themselves. No doubt when climatic changes get overwhelming people who support Trump and infowars speakers will also say 'oh I was just joking'. If you make a mistake; own it and fix it. Don't rationalize and make excuses.

infowars is just another source for news. does MSNBC solve crimes or report them? just news friend. now infowars has been blacklisted as fake news.  Cheesy heh. i wonder why?

Very simple; i will give an example Eric and this is from my own observation...no one else's. After finding the info to validate my concerns I found articles to reaffirm them; you posted a video from infa wars about regulating cow farts. Yes indeed i listened to the whole video but it is false news. They have a law in California (not the United States) regulating methane levels from manure which is not car farts. Sorry folks but this is very fake news from infa wars.

https://thinkprogress.org/california-super-pollutant-law-a71f30642543#.jduew7jbj

Hey Art,

I watched infowars today and thought it was funny to find the same article you posted up on seaweed reducing cow farts in their video. I think taxing major corporations for carbon emissions may spur ingenious energy alternative solutions i still don't know the practicality of it all or the willingness for individuals to be taxed. I also thought the article on the cow farts was pretty awesome lol but again don't know how economical this solution is.




Also, being a potent greenhouse gas, water vapor will further accelerate warming of the Arctic. ... On a 10-year timescale, methane causes more warming than carbon dioxide. Unlike carbon dioxide, methane's Global Warming Potential rises as more of it is released.

So let's clear up the fake news;

http://thehill.com/policy/energy-environment/229567-epa-unveils-first-methane-regulations

This is what infra wars calls cow farts and is thus guilty of false news;

Methane (CH4): Methane is emitted during the production and transport of coal, natural gas, and oil. Methane emissions also result from livestock and other agricultural practices and by the decay of organic waste in municipal solid waste landfills.
« Last Edit: Nov 18, 2016 04:15 am by Steve Hydonus » Report Spam   Logged

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« Reply #1 on: Dec 12, 2016 06:55 pm »



and the article from the guardian mentioned briefly in the video above:
Stop worrying about fake news. What comes next will be much worse
Jonathan Albright

"In the not too distant future, technology giants will decide what news sources we are allowed to consult, and alternative voices will be silenced"

from, https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2016/dec/09/fake-news-technology-filters

on the countering disinformation act:
Countering Foreign Propaganda and Disinformation Act is a bipartisan bill, introduced to the 114th United States Congress to respond to propaganda and disinformation. The bill was initially titled as the Countering Information Warfare Act.

The bipartisan legislation was written in March 2016 by U.S. Senators Republican Rob Portman and Democrat Chris Murphy. It was additionally introduced in the United States House of Representatives in a bipartisan fashion; co-sponsors included Republican Congressman Adam Kinzinger and Democrat Ted Lieu.

In both the House and Senate the bill was included in the National Defense Authorization Act for fiscal year 2017. It passed the House in this fashion in a conference report vote on December 2, 2016. The Senate then passed the measure in a conference report on December 8 by a tally of 92-7.

from, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Countering_Foreign_Propaganda_and_Disinformation_Act
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« Reply #2 on: Dec 13, 2016 11:10 am »

Comon' Eric He claims that Clinton funded Al Qaeda and ISIS What kind of news is this? It's not even worth listening to. I had to stop after that and some flimsy accusations with no substance. I already explained in detail the false news from infowars about methane. You did not respond. Let's move on. This man is a waste of energy. Every time I listen to him he says something else foolish. The latest about Clinton was an out right lie.

Remember I was againt the war from the beginning. I voted for Bernie Sanders. But to lie about Clinton is despicable. She and Trump have both supported crushing ISIS. Not only that but Alex accuses Clinton of being responsible with ISIS for funding war crimes. He took a quote out of context and construed it to mean Clinton supported ISIS. It was one sentence that did not even mention ISIS. Clinton was just saying that the the United States at one time supported the people who are now our enemies. She is correct. This is a serious concern about the mideast and our relation to it. It is a result of misplaced priorities of the United States. That is one of the main causes of this happening. At one time the U.S. supported Iraq when they were against Iran. This is just getting to be too cumbersome to have to research Alex Jones numerous false statements. He totally misunderstood or worst yet lied about what Clinton said.

Quite frankly I can not keep up with you and your bogus news when you fail to respond to what I have already explained that were false news. Eric; You are not engaging in conversation but rather constant attact. Respond to my points or you are only attacting. People that speak of differences in views usually listen to what another has said and then respond. I have done so. Your method lacks response and only continues attacts. In this case about Clinton and the last one about methane their was no validity in the attacts and I spend a lot of time explaining. It is a waste of time for me to continue to respond to attacts with no conversation from you in these political matters.

http://www.cnn.com/2015/11/19/politics/hillary-clinton-isis-speech/index.html
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« Reply #3 on: Dec 13, 2016 11:59 pm »

Hello Steve. Thank you for your reply. Hopefully my reply will clear the air since it is not my intention to attack by sharing opinions and idea's here on your forum. My goal in sharing the views expressed from InfoWars is indeed to discuss my findings on censorship and what it might mean for the future. This thread titled fake news started from the conversation below,
Quote
In the aftermath of Trumps surprising win people have been scrambling to make sense of what happened. Facebook has now come under the scrutiny for facilitating the spread of fake news stories in the weeks preceding the election.



The hypothesis is that a proliferation of patently false news stories trending on facebook may have helped to swing the election in Trump's favor. We will very likely hear more about social media companies taking efforts to crack down on "fake news". Google and Facebook have already issued statements with their intentions to do that.

http://fusion.net/story/370735/edward-snowden-facebook-fake-news/
https://www.cnet.com/news/facebook-mark-zuckerberg-fake-news-affect-election-techonomy-donald-trump-crazy/



As Zuckerberg said in a facebook, they have to be very careful in being the arbiters of "truth". A sentiment I agree with. What do you think is a company like facebook's role in something like this?


This "Countering Foreign Propaganda and Disinformation Act" to me seems in direct conflict with freedom of speech.

"Freedom of speech is the right to articulate one's opinions and ideas without fear of government retaliation or censorship, or societal sanction.[1][2][3][4] The term freedom of expression is sometimes used synonymously, but includes any act of seeking, receiving and imparting information or ideas, regardless of the medium used."
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freedom_of_speech

Should we be concerned the government wants to "train" journalist? I found the video below very interesting as did millions of other viwers. These alternative sources open up the discussion by bringing corruption to the fore. Not once did I ask you to agree but I question this attempt at censorship and what it may mean for us down the road.
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« Reply #4 on: Dec 14, 2016 01:47 am »

U have a small link with Snowden talking. I often listen to him with interest because he is in Russia but is a U.S. citizen. It seems like he would be able to see news with a different perspective not bring a part of just U.S. news but being able to see it from a Russian view as well. I would think that mccoy might see our culture with some perspective as well... coming from a different culture.

I am glad to see you have come up with news from other sources in your last post. I find infowar very inaccurate and quite often hostile and aggressive in its approach. I know you like that network but by the lies I have already heard from them I am very reluctant to even spend much time at any of their videos. I am interested in any news sources other then infowar. I think we should remember that to think of climate change as something mustered up by the media is  falicy. Most all the major scientists today agree that this is not true and it is their view that we are at a critical time in the history of mankind.
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« Reply #5 on: Dec 14, 2016 09:30 am »

I sympathize with Eric's concerns about censorship. But I also understand the problem which they are trying to address. It is a complex issue. I think we should err on the side of free speech, of course. But the concern is mostly about another country trying to manipulate the population with propaganda, as in the case of Russia potentially trying to influence this current election. And then there's the simple dumbing down of people which has far reaching effects. Should media outlets be allowed to practice unchecked lying and propaganda? I mean, no news source is going to be 100% accurate. News outlets are operated by human beings and mistakes will get made; bias will creep in. This is why, more than anything else in my opinion, we need a renaissance of critical thinking.

Here is an example of the effects of fake news. It unfortunately endangers real people's lives. And yes, this story about the child rape ring/pizza shop was run by infowars who caught heat after this incident and, I believe, removed the video (not before I saw it!).

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/12/07/us/edgar-welch-comet-pizza-fake-news.html?_r=0

It is going to be hard to legislate intellectual and journalistic integrity I'm afraid. And I can appreciate concerns that legislation like this (I haven't read it) might become a tool for an oppression and tyranny.
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« Reply #6 on: Dec 14, 2016 09:42 am »

Okay, someone has uploaded the pizzagate video back onto YouTube but I believe (could be wrong) that it has been removed from infowar's main channel. In this video you can see the way they use suggestions and imagery to influence you the viewer while actually leaving the question open ended (but the conclusion is drawn through the power of suggestion). Now you can see how a young man might watch this and grab his gun to go save some kids. 

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« Reply #7 on: Dec 14, 2016 09:56 am »

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« Reply #8 on: Dec 14, 2016 12:05 pm »

Since we have so many videos of this man (not my choice) on our site I would like to express my concern and observations about him. I have seen journalists on his site that are openly hostile. Since these are my own personal observations about him I moved them with more details under 'Freedom to Express.'
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« Reply #9 on: Dec 14, 2016 08:10 pm »

Hi Brock,

Mainstream media has been caught faking news on more then one occasion and the concern is not just an outside influence as much as it is corruption in all aspects. There are also countless examples of unstable people reacting to the news when on many occasions, our own networks aims to perpetuate fear and violence for personal gain. Having the freedom to question our governments motifs and express ones concern is protected under the first amendment. The government has been caught lying before but wishes to be the ultimate deciding factor when it comes to alternative media's expressing their own views.

When asked, why is freedom of speech important?

Quote
In areas of the world where freedom of speech is not protected, citizens are afraid to speak out against their government, even when it acts illegally, for fear of being locked away in a cell for life. According to the University of Virginia, historically, men, women and even some children were put to death for daring to speak out against a tyrannical monarch, an unjust parliament or legislature or even a powerful corporation.
Taken from,
https://www.reference.com/government-politics/freedom-speech-important-84e52a68cd531b83#
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« Reply #10 on: Dec 14, 2016 08:50 pm »

Eric i apologize if i am interupting your conversation directed at Brock. We find false information in mainstream media as well as alternative media--  Brock and i have showed you this with infowars and you have brought up points about mainstream media. Yet you (Eric) are right about one thing in particular; we must watch that this freedom of speech is never expunged from us. You have that freedom to bring any news source you wish at spiritualportal. Unlike other forums and sites we have encountered in the past. It is really up to us to find out what is true and what is not; not our government or any 'class of people' .... and that is what we are doing here at the Portal. We have that free expression here. We have had people here who have censored us on other sites and have taken us off those sites and have tried to censore others here as well. We have managed to not allow this to happen. We must all be aware and alert that 'Brave New World' does not start here or in America.

The First Amendment (Amendment I) to the United States Constitution prohibits the making of any law respecting an establishment of religion, ensuring that there is no prohibition on the free exercise of religion, abridging the freedom of speech, infringing on the freedom of the press, interfering with the right to peaceably assemble, or prohibiting the petitioning for a governmental redress of grievances. It was adopted on December 15, 1791, as one of the ten amendments that constitute the Bill of Rights.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First_Amendment_to_the_United_States_Constitution
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« Reply #11 on: Dec 15, 2016 12:57 am »

I think we can more or less agree on this topic. The benefits of free speech and open inquiry are many. However, while free speech is recognized, there are some nuances and caveats. I am pretty sure your right to yell fire in a movie theater is still not protected. There are also apparently laws relating to slander, such that you can get sued for your speech. The yelling of fire in a theater is probably a good example here, though. Media companies are basically amplifiers for whatever passes through them. How much responsibility do companies like Facebook have for the information that passes through them? I am not sure. I'm definitely not inclined to want Mark Zuckerburg, or an algorithm for that matter, deciding what is fit for me to read.

But again - it's not black and white. Consider the cost of attention. Our attention is now a scarce resource compared to the amount of information there is to consume. We simply don't have time to examine every single article and counter-article during a news cycle. The best we can do is try to calibrate our minds to pick up on a more or less truthy narrative and decide what to read and believe based on that. Critical thinking and intelligence are necessary for that. But it won't make us perfect. You'll get some shit wrong sometimes and be mislead on occasion. The best we can hope for is to reduce that by training ourselves to think as clearly as possible. This means being honest with ourselves about our own biases and gaps of knowledge.

How can we really make the best possible life for ourselves if we are delusional?

Oh well, I have to run for now.

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« Reply #12 on: Dec 15, 2016 05:50 am »

I think we can more or less agree on this topic. The benefits of free speech and open inquiry are many. However, while free speech is recognized, there are some nuances and caveats. I am pretty sure your right to yell fire in a movie theater is still not protected. There are also apparently laws relating to slander, such that you can get sued for your speech. The yelling of fire in a theater is probably a good example here, though. Media companies are basically amplifiers for whatever passes through them. How much responsibility do companies like Facebook have for the information that passes through them? I am not sure. I'm definitely not inclined to want Mark Zuckerburg, or an algorithm for that matter, deciding what is fit for me to read.

But again - it's not black and white. Consider the cost of attention. Our attention is now a scarce resource compared to the amount of information there is to consume. We simply don't have time to examine every single article and counter-article during a news cycle. The best we can do is try to calibrate our minds to pick up on a more or less truthy narrative and decide what to read and believe based on that. Critical thinking and intelligence are necessary for that. But it won't make us perfect. You'll get some shit wrong sometimes and be mislead on occasion. The best we can hope for is to reduce that by training ourselves to think as clearly as possible. This means being honest with ourselves about our own biases and gaps of knowledge.

How can we really make the best possible life for ourselves if we are delusional?

Oh well, I have to run for now.



I am glad to see your response Brock because if we have total free speech it means we would allow terrorist planning activities here which I do not think any of us would agree with. I think we would have to talk it over in admin if things got really strange. So we might ask the same thing of the government; where and when do they draw the line?
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« Reply #13 on: Dec 16, 2016 03:33 am »

Hi Brock,

Thanks for your reply. Something you said at the end of your post really helped me understand how I feel about this censorship attempt.

The best we can do is try to calibrate our minds to pick up on a more or less truthy narrative and decide what to read and believe based on that. Critical thinking and intelligence are necessary for that. ... The best we can hope for is to reduce that by training ourselves to think as clearly as possible. This means being honest with ourselves about our own biases and gaps of knowledge.

Having someone else decide what is real and what is not denies the individual the right to exercise critical thinking and breeds laziness. If Facebook is banning alternative view's because it is not in line with the "truth" does that necessarily make it Truth? If the government has been caught lying before but wishes to be the final say, is this really in favor of protecting the innocent? Innocence and meekness are not the same although it seems some of our own politicians and people of authority view the masses this way.

Decent and mature individuals don't yell fire in a theater if there is no fire. Yet, a person should have the freedom to express their opinion and beliefs and if it's bull shit it usually doesn't hold up. Banning "fake news" is taking away your right to call something BS if that's what it is.

Steve I know you're tired of these videos but I find this relevant to our discussion:
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« Reply #14 on: Dec 27, 2016 07:01 pm »



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